Go Bottomsynthetic oil
 | greg h
Join Date: Posts: 1 
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1999-06-18 5265
after checking the manual on my new kubota 4310gst i found that anyone interested can indeed use mobil 1 10w30 in these tractors. it calls for rating of cc ,cd. mobil 1 has an api rating of cf. due to the short change intervals of machines used in dirty environments the cf-4 and ch-4 ratings are not needed.they indicate an oils ability to keep large amounts of soot suspended insteadof settling out in the engine. the new environment friendly engines load up the oil with soot more than old engines. hope this is of interest to someone.
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| Mr. C.W. Meekins
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-06-18 5277
There is no need to use synthetic oil in your tractor engine.Those engines were designed for standard petroleum oils.Our tractor engines benefit much more by using a quality name brand pet. oil and keeping CLEAN filters inplace. One of those diese fuel additives sold in farmers supply will boost the lubricity of the fuel and do much more good than synthetic oil. ....
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| Mike
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-06-19 5308
Mobil makes "Delvec" which is a full synthetic oil designed for diesels. By using a synthetic you will find better starting in cold weather, smoother-cleaner running engine. Far less wear in your engine due to the superior lubricating charateristics of synthetics. ....
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| MichaelSnyder
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 0
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1999-06-21 5368
Greg,I almost feel that I need to apologies for Mr.C.W.'s message. He appearantly knows nothing about this subject. There is no such thing as "Our engine are designed for Petroleum oil".As with his recommendation of adding a "special additives". Mr C.W. appearantly doesn't know that every major race team in the world has been using Synthetics for YEARS! And Jet engines use nothing but synthetics, why? because Petroleum oils can't handle the extreme pressures & heat these engines generate. Never mind the fact that they havebeen proven time & time again to be FAR superior to Petro oils.ONE of MY personal Testimonials:1990 Acura 4 cylinder with over 185,000 hard miles on the odoAcura recommends valve adjustment every 30k miles(4 valves per cyl)My first adjustment was at 139,000 miles. Upon servicing,the Acura mechanic was taking picturesof the valves, because he never saw a vehicle where valves that haven't been adjusted for 140K mileswere in factory spec's, and had Zero sludge build up Not to mention the 1-2 miles to the gallon fuel mileage increase in every vehicle I've ever owned when switched to Synthetics. FYI, I change oil and filter every 15-20K miles, and use about 1 quart every oil change. The label recommends 1 year or 25K miles.I'm sure Mr. C.W. has plenty of experience with synthetics vs. Petroleum oils, to be making a statement like he did. ....
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| ken
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-06-21 5374
I presume Mr. C. W. was referring to tractor engines and if they were not designed to use petroleum oils, in your expert opinion, exactly what were they designed to use? Race car and jet engines are in almost all cases designed to use synthetics because of the high stresses you noted. How can you be so baised and insulting. Mr. C. W. is simply trying to tell us from his experience the use of synthetic oil is not needed. I tend to agree. My experience goes back to using sythetics when they first came out and I learned early you don't want to switch a used engine to synthetics because it will cause leaks in seals and gaskets that never leaked before. Upon switching back to petroleum oil they stopped. I just hated the leaks all over the garage floor. Oh, that first vehicle I tried it on was a 74 Ford pick-up which I still own. It now has over 165,000 miles, has had the oil and filter changed every 2000 to 3000 since new, and has never had the engine opened up. It lost garage status many years ago, but I recently drove it on a 350 mile round trip and parked it in the garage upon return and not a drop of oil on the floor the next morning. I doubt you can't say that about the Acura. I feel you should at least consider appologizing to Mr. C. W. ....
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| MichaelSnyder
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 0
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1999-06-21 5375
Ken,Thanks for putting me in my place, I don't normally write from home, due to slow net connections, but I really felt like a jerk driving home tonight. I deeply apologies for my message to anyone who read it, and especially Mr.C.W.My boss had a bad day, and.....you know the rest. But I had no right to take it out on all of you. so again my apologies. Not that it matters to anyone, but no the Acura was never garaged, opened (minus valve adjustments), or leaks.What I meant to say is that Synthetics IMHO are well worth the extra money. Itfine that many people don't feel the same. My initial reason for switching wasfor extended drain intervals. I drive 90-125 miles per day, thus changing oil quite a bit. After switching to synthetic, I noticed an average of 2 MPG increase, and temp gauge ran one dash lower(Approx 20-30 Degrees). I unfortunately share a similar story as your leaking truck did. My 82' Jeep scrambler started to leak really bad after switching to synthetic, To the point that it ended up in the shop. My mechanic felt that the synthetics ate at the sludge, because the oil filter was filled solid. Sure enough I had to replace every seal. Afterwards, same results as the Acura. 98'Dodge Ram 24v diesel started hard in the winter, not after synthetics. Plus the oil pressure gauge read normal MUCH quicker. 90' Mustang GT Dyno'ed 5.3 more horsepower with nothing changed but regular Valvoline 10-40 to AMSOIL synthetic 10-40. I could go on and on, but my point was to convey only a small portion of my experiences with synthetics and what I found to be a few of their benefits. I'm sorry I could't write it the first time. ....
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| MChalkley
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-06-22 5408
My experiences are very similar, and I won't bore everyone with the bandwidth detailing the half-dozen or so I could relate that I feel "prove" synthetics superiorty.But there is a test that almost everyone can try and always tells anyone with any mechanical ability whatsoever something very important. You may have to borrow an infra-red non-contact thermometer from someone, but they'Ve come down in price so much and are so handy to have around, that you might just go buy one after borrowing it (and no, I don't make them or sell them). Anyway, just measure the temperature of your favorite device someplace where the oil is freshly returned from doing its job after working it a little in a reproducible fashion. Do this when you're running petroleum oil and then switch over to synthetic and repeat the measurement in the exact same conditions. You will be amazed, unless you're already convinced of the superior properties of synthetics. And I don't think you need to be a physics major to know that the heat is produced by friction, and friction results in wear, and reduced friction means less wear, and less wear means longer life, ad infinitum, ad nauseum. Not to mention the benefits of reduced thermal shock, expansion & contraction, etc.One of my favorite places to measure is on a hydrostatic transmission where the oil comes out of the motor on its way to the cooler, but other transmissions and engines produce similar results, only not usually as dramatic, mostly because it's difficult to get to a good spot to measure the oil temp before surrounding metal siphons off the heat.But please, folks, don't take anybody's word for it, try it yourself. If you'd believe me, you'd just as easily believe somebody who said petroleum is better. You can find out for yourself, if you just want to. Then you would know, and you could just smile when all the hooey is bandied about between folks who don't. ....
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| ken
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-06-22 5418
Great response mls. To you and Mark, I couldn't agree more that synthetics oil are superior. I just don't feel they are needed in my situation. I have 4 vehicles, spread the little milege we drive out between them and end up almost never putting over 6500 miles per year on any. And 90% of the mileage is trips of less than 5 miles. I change oil (Penzoil) and filter (Fram)in the newer vehicles every 2000 miles for about an average of $6.50 per change. I have a 90 4-runner and the head gaskets were just changed because of a toyota recall on their V-6 engines due to suspected faulty gaskets material. I asked the service manager and mechanic to give me their evaluation of how clean the inside of the engine was. They said it was one of the cleanest engines they had ever gone inside. Also by changing my oil myself every 2000 it gives me an opertunity to examine the underside of the vehicles closely and catch small problems before they become major expenses.Now Mark a little test for you. Take a screwdiver with a wide (3/8") flat blade, dip the tip in regular motor oil and place the tip between your thumb and forefinger and see if you can hold it. You will be able to. Clean it off and try the same thing with sythetic oil, you will still be able to hold it, although it will be more difficult. Clean it off again and dip the tip in STP and superman couldn't hold it. What was it Mr. C.W. said about oil additives? ....
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| MichaelSnyder
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 0
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1999-06-23 5430
One thing I wanted to add, but forgot. Somewhat unrelated to Synthetic oil, but part of the big picture. I am reposting the net address of the oil filter study.Take the references to Mopar products out of the equation, and you are leftwith some pretty good info on filters and their construction. My reason for bringingthis up is that NO oil can properly do its job without a quality filter. Also, thefindings within this article are on par with something I read in oh.. I think itwas "Consumer Reports". I would encourage everyone to read this article and take theinfo to heart. Not that my judgement matters to anyone, but the fact that this reseach is in-line with others I've seen, I tend to believe its true. Decide for yourself.http://minimopar.simplenet.com/oilfilterstudy.html ....
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| Bill
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-07-20 6151
Ken,With regard to short trips and frequent starts, you are one who could probably bennefit the most from what most synthetics offer. The fact that you repeatedly start the engine, and only drive it for very short distances, does not allow the oil to even heat up enough to drive off any condensation, unless you drive like Mario Andretti. This allows acids to build up in the oil and it attacks anything it comes into contact with. Secondly, the action of starting a dry engine over and over again to get 6500 miles per year is very hard due to the fact that most engine wear occures at start up and shortly there after, while the engine is running, and oil has not yet circulated to all vital parts. I use Amsoil, and it clings to metal, and stays in place with much greater tenacity than other oils I have used, including Mobile 1. This helps in two ways in my opinion. It lubrcates while the engine oil pump gets what is in the sump around the engine, and the tenacity of the coating left helps keep the acids away from those vital parts. Thirdly, the easy pumpibility of synthetics gets that oil around to everything much faster. Last but not least, extended drains, or better yet doing analysis and filter changes using a quality oil helps save oil resourses and the enviroment. And an added benefit, which I recently had the good luck of having, it helps show if there is a problem with the engine, long before you would notice it, and long before it does any permanent damage to those extremely expensive vehicles, or tractors as in this site. So your assesment that it wouldn't benefit you much may be slightly off base, but that is your decision, as it is, as they say on the World News Tonight, Your Money.Good luck with the vehicles.Bill ....
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